Kine:

Welcome back to Alveskog – Voices of the Soul.

I’m really excited about today’s episode, because this is something I know inspires both of us — and it’s been a big part of our own journey.

Paal:

Absolutely.

Kine:

I think you can start off today’s episode Paal, and then we’ll move through the theme of vulnerability.

And I was thinking — maybe we can begin with a little definition of what vulnerability actually is.

Paal:

Yes.

Society often views vulnerability as a weakness, because it’s associated with emotions like fear, shame, sorrow, insecurity — things most people try to avoid or suppress.

It’s often linked to a lack of resilience or robustness, which implies weakness rather than strength.

Kine:

Yes.

Paal:

And that’s not really how we see it.

Kine:

No, not at all.

For us, vulnerability has probably been one of our greatest strengths.

Paal:

And the key to a lot of progress in our personal lives.

Kine:

Yes, absolutely.

Paal:

And as a couple.

Kine:

Yes.

Next week, we’re actually doing an episode about vulnerability in relationships, but for today we are talking about vulnerability in general

Paal:

Right.

Kine:

So lets dive into vulnerability — what it has meant for us on our journey, and what it’s looked like through our own process of healing and growth.

For me, I’d say vulnerability has been a heavy wall to climb.

Because for me, vulnerability has always felt like..well, maybe a weakness.

Paal:

That’s what we’ve been taught to believe.

Kine:

Yes, I think so — we live in a society that tells us that if you’re vulnerable, you’re missing something, or you’re not strong enough to handle life.

Paal:

That you’re weak.

Kine:

That you’re weak, yes.

And that — at least for me personally — has been a big thing.

To allow myself to be vulnerable.

It applies to my story, to what I’ve experienced, and learning that vulnerability can actually become a strength.

I don’t know, what do you think about that for your part?

Paal:

I completely agree.

I read a book last year that really opened my eyes and inspired me deeply — it’s a book by Brené Brown.

It’s about shame, but vulnerability is a big part of it.

We can share that book on our page afterward.

Kine:

What does Brené Brown say about it?

Paal:

She has almost the opposite view of what society teaches. She believes vulnerability is a source of courage, empathy, and authenticity — the birthplace of meaningful human emotions like love, belonging, and joy.

She says that vulnerability is essential for living wholeheartedly and for building deep connections.

And this wholeheartedness, as she puts it, is what people who are — in a positive sense — “shameless” have. It’s what prevents shame from stopping them from living fully.

She sees vulnerability as a strength because it takes courage to show your true self — despite the risk of rejection or judgment or whatever it might be.

To be vulnerable means you take that risk — and that it’s worth it.

Kine:

And that’s something we’ve really experienced.

Even this podcast itself, I think…

Paal:

Yes.

Kine: It is a perfect example of that — being vulnerable and putting yourself out there.

To share your story.

Paal:

Openly and honestly.

Kine:

Openly and honestly.

And at the same time feeling that, okay — even if I might be judged, at least I’ve been my authentic self.

I’ve allowed myself to be vulnerable, and that in itself is a strength.

And we’ve definitely experienced that through the episodes we’ve released so far.

Paal:

Very much so.

Kine:

And I’d say there are many kinds of vulnerability.

In today’s world, there are children who are labeled as vulnerable, and society often look at that as something negative.

I’d say our society isn’t quite ready for vulnerability yet — though it’s slowly starting to discover it in a new way.

Of course, there are some kinds of vulnerability that require more support — like children who need extra help — and there are many degrees of vulnerability.

But I think the message we want to share is this:

Don’t be afraid of it.

Be open. Be authentic.

And know that it is a strength.

Paal:

There’s nothing that builds more genuine relationships than vulnerability.

Kine:

No.

Paal:

And really — the people who can’t handle your vulnerability aren’t meant for you.

Kine:

No, that’s something worth reflecting on.

To feel that you can be vulnerable, even in difficult situations — that’s real strength.

I was looking up how the Norwegian Health Directorate defines vulnerability, and they describe it as a kind of lack — like in computer terms, if a system has a vulnerability, it’s more exposed to viruses or damage.

And for much of my life, I think I saw vulnerability like that too — as something filled with shame.

Something you had to hide.

You couldn’t show it.

But along my journey, I’ve worked a lot with my own vulnerability.

And we’ve worked with it together — in our relationship too.

To be able to say, in a difficult moment, “I’m struggling right now” — that’s been a journey in itself.

Paal:

And that brings us to the word trust — trusting that when you’re open and vulnerable, the response you get back will be good, that you’re safe.

Kine:

But then there are those times when you don’t feel that safety — when being vulnerable doesn’t feel safe.

We can take an example — like moments of loss, when someone dies.

In those moments, vulnerability is almost natural, even expected.

And that kind of vulnerability isn’t really judged — it’s accepted.

Paal:

Yes, that’s one of those situations where almost everyone would agree it’s natural to be vulnerable — and people don’t really react negatively to that.

Kine:

Exactly.

But then there are other moments in life — when you choose to be yourself in the presence of others.

I see that a lot with children in school situations.

I’m part of a group for parents of children who struggle with involuntary school absence, and many of them say that having a vulnerable child in contact with the system is really difficult.

The system doesn’t seem ready for it — they don’t really know how to meet it.

And I’ve often thought the same in my own encounters with the system:

“Can you actually handle it if I show my vulnerability, or will you shut the door?”

That’s something I’ve experienced firsthand.

Paal:

Society depends a lot on putting people into boxes — so it knows where to place them.

Whether that box is a diagnosis or a behavior pattern — it doesn’t matter much.

As long as there’s a label.

But a person who’s genuinely vulnerable, who doesn’t wear a mask — that person is hard to fit into a box.

And I think that’s a big part of the challenge.

Kine:

Yes.

I think the system we have today — in schools, workplaces,social services, all of it — isn’t really built to hold human vulnerability yet.

But I believe we’ll see more and more of it.

Because I don’t think we’re meant to carry all this shame and fear anymore.

We’re slowly opening up — and that means the system needs to grow too.

We need to realize that vulnerability is something we must work with, not hide from.

It’s deeply human.

Paal:

Completely agree.

And as I mentioned earlier, one thing I find fascinating is the masks we wear.

Most people wear many masks — depending on the situation, who they’re with, or how they want to appear.

But what all those masks have in common is the fear of taking them off.

The fear of being vulnerable.

The fear of being your true self, one hundred percent.

What do you think about that?

Kine:

I can relate completely.

That’s what comes to mind right away — I can really relate.

Paal:

It’s something we all do, to some degree.

Kine:

In so many situations, yes.

We have a mother mask, a father mask, a work mask, a school mask, a sibling mask — there are so many masks.

Paal:

In every setting.

Kine:

Yes, in so many settings.

And I often think — what happens when we start taking those masks off, slowly but surely?

When we start allowing ourselves to be who we truly are, and realize that it’s safe — that it’s okay?

And maybe for those listening, ask yourself:

“What does vulnerability mean for me?”

“Can I be vulnerable?”

“Can I be real?”

“Do I have people around me who meet me in my vulnerability?”

And if not — feel into that too.

Ask yourself:

“Why not?”

“Is it shame?”

“Is it fear?”

“What triggers me?”

That’s such an important part of becoming truly vulnerable.

Paal:

And what’s the fear really about?

Is it even real?

Is it necessary?

There are so many questions.

Fear of rejection, for example — fear that people won’t like you when you show your true self.

Like I said earlier — those people might not be meant for you.

But that’s easier said than accepted sometimes.

And also, when people react or get triggered by your vulnerability, it’s often because you mirror something in them — something they haven’t allowed themselves to express.

That’s important, not just in vulnerability, but in all human relationships.

Kine:

Absolutely.

And I want to talk a bit about children and vulnerability — because that’s something we’ve really experienced too.

Maybe you can tell the listeners how you were as a dad before?

Paal:

Classic 80s upbringing — strict, tough love.

“Get up, it’s not that bad,” “shake it off” — all that.

Basically, devaluing the child’s emotions.

Kine:

Not really comforting them.

Paal:

No, more like, “Come on, get up again.”

Kine:

“It didn’t hurt that much.”

Paal:

Yes — trying to make them tougher.

Kine:

To harden them a bit.

Paal:

To make them less vulnerable, maybe.

Kine:

There it is.

Paal:

That was my autopilot as a father before.

Kine:

And now you have a daughter who is vulnerable.

Paal:

Yes — very. And it’s been a steep learning curve.

Kine:

Has it been easy?

Paal:

No — and probably not over yet. But we’re getting there.

Kine:

What do you notice in those moments with her?

Paal:

Sometimes I have to take a deep breath before I speak.

It’s so easy to fall back into that old autopilot, even though I catch it most of the time now.

But it still triggers me — because when a child shows deep vulnerability, it can feel like you can’t handle it.

You want the child to be how you think they should be.

Kine:

How you’ve imagined.

Paal:

Exactly. That’s the old programming.

And then I have to stop, breathe, and catch myself.

Kine:

So in a way, you have to face your own vulnerability too?

Paal:

Absolutely.

It’s partly about vulnerability, partly about childhood programming — how I was raised and what I learned to see as normal.

But on all levels, it’s about awareness — catching myself in the moment and choosing differently, even when it’s hard.

Kine:

What would you say has been the greatest gift of having a vulnerable child?

Paal:

That it’s forced me to look inward — to actually see what I’m doing, where it comes from, and to change it.

Kine:

Now, some might say girls are more vulnerable — but I think it’s more that they’re emotionally more connected.

but There are also boys who are very vulnerable and need the same kind of understanding.

But maybe you feel it even more because she’s a girl, and she needs her dad to meet her where she is.

That’s really the key — you can’t walk further with your child than you’ve walked with yourself.

Paal:

Exactly. That’s the golden rule of life and relationships — you can’t guide anyone further than you’ve gone yourself. That’s our real task.

Kine:

Yes.

And for us, it’s been a steep learning curve — breaking away from those old patterns of parenting, choosing instead to say:

“I allow my child to be vulnerable.”

“That’s okay.”

And we’ll support her through it — so she knows she’s seen and heard, even when she’s vulnerable.

That’s been so important — not just for her, but for us too.

Paal:

To know you’re still met, even when you’re vulnerable.

Kine:

Yes — to know you’re still met.

That’s huge.

Not just for adults, but for children too.

Paal:

Very important.

Kine:

Many of us who grew up in the 60s, 70s, 80s — even 90s — were taught differently.

But society is changing now.

We’re seeing more children who are deeply sensitive and vulnerable.

And instead of boxing them in and labeling them— saying “this is autism,” “this is that” — maybe we should just let them be.

Let them feel.

Let them know it’s okay to be vulnerable, as long as they’re met with safety and love.

And that’s what we’ve chosen — the opposite of suppression.

We’ve chosen to say:

“You’re allowed to feel this.”

“You’re allowed to be vulnerable.”

And it’s okay.

Because that’s how you grow into an authentic human being.

And that’s been such a big lesson for us.

Paal:

Without fear and without shame.

Kine:

Yes — without fear and without shame.

But we’ve also seen how schools and systems still try to put children in boxes, to fix them — instead of meeting them.

That’s something we’ve both experienced.

And it really shows that the system isn’t ready yet.

There needs to be a shift — in schools, in public systems — in how we understand vulnerability.

We shouldn’t be so afraid of it.

Paal:

People need to look inward — to meet their own vulnerability and make peace with it.

Kine:

At least try.

And if you feel resistance, don’t be afraid of that either.

Try to ask:

“What’s stopping me?”

Paal:

“And where does it come from?”

Kine:

Yes — “where does it come from?”

Maybe you’ll have to go far back and you realize, “Oh — this is something I learned in childhood.”

“Maybe I experienced something that taught me vulnerability wasn’t safe.”

And that becomes programming — a belief.

Paal:

Exactly — a belief.

Kine:

Yes.

And that’s something worth reflecting on.

We’ll be going even deeper into this next week when we talk about vulnerability in relationships

Paal:

I’m really looking forward to that.

Kine:

Me too.

So I think we’ll end here for today.

If you have thoughts or reflections about vulnerability, we’d love to hear from you.

Send us a message — we’re always open to hearing where you are on your journey, and we’d love to have you with us on this journey.

We’ll also link to Brené Brown’s book, daring greatly — because shame and vulnerability are so closely connected, and it’s really worth exploring.

Paal:

We’ll do that.

Kine:

So then I guess we’ll say — until next time.

Paal:

Yes — and do remember..we are better together

Thank you for listening.

Kine:

Thank you for being here with us.